Monday, December 8, 2014
John Donne article by Linda Gregerson
Read the article by Linda Gregerson titled "On John Donne." Is she genuine in her love of Donne's poetry? Evaluate her choice of language in using phrases such as "delicious adventure....[his] syntax was a high wire act.....his metaphors were intricate and wild and stretched to outrageousness.....his misogyny....sexy." What is your response to Gregerson's break down of Donne's "musicality" and "rhetoric" in the examples given? Finally, how do Donne's religious poems capture the author the most?
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“Poems weren’t yet alive for me; I didn’t know what to do with them.” This is a line from Linda Gregerson’s “On John Donne”. I find it very interesting because of the background she gave in just the few sentences before. She liked to read, analyze, and “get lost” in the things she was reading. However, she never got into poetry when she was younger. I find this very strange because I find poetry very easy to get “lost in” or drawn into. Gregerson says that she “learned how to think by reading.” Poetry is one of the greatest forms of expression as well as one of the most thought provoking things one can find in literature. Because of the deep thinking it takes to read poetry, I found it even stranger when I read, “And thinking, especially when tethered to feeling, was fun.” Poetry causes the reader to do so much thinking; I just don’t understand how it never felt “alive” to her in her adolescence. I however, can relate to Linda Gregerson when she says she had to stop and think who her favorite poet was. I struggled to think of mine. That was until I thought of the first “real” poem I read. I don’t remember the title of it, but it was by Emily Dickinson. Just as I discovered Dickinson, Gregerson found John Donne.
ReplyDeleteAt the beginning, the first paragraph to be exact, I was unsure of where the article was going. Continuing to read though, I felt a very real feeling that Gregerson was genuine in her thoughts and feelings for Donne. In the second paragraph she writes about the Donne’s poetry. She says the poem on the page she was reading was suddenly “delicious adventure”. Besides this being an interesting way to describe Donne’s poetry, it really gives off the feelings of true interest and enthusiasm for the poem. She says that the language in Donne’s poem “was electric”. The definition of the word electric is “having or producing a sudden sense of thrilling excitement”. However, electric is also a form of lighting and heat production. When I read this line, I thought of it as John Donne’s poetry lighting a fire with Gregerson that would burn forever. “His syntax was a high wire act” was my least favorite line when I read the article. However, when I went back and read it again so I could comment on it, it became one of my favorite. “High wire” is like tight rope walking which takes incredible skill, practice, and intelligence. John Donne’s use of syntax throughout all of his poems is worthy of mesmerizing intelligence. Donne’s metaphors, like the one comparing love to a compass in “A Valediction: Forbidding Mourning” is so intricate that it is now known as one of the best conceits in literature. The last sentence in the second paragraph tells of true emotion and liking of John Donne. Gregerson says that “his very preening and misogyny—were sexy”. Misogyny, which I had to look up, means a dislike of, contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against women. By Linda Gregerson saying this it shows that she truly fell in love with Donne’s poetry because he was not partial to the male gender and was open to the female mind and interpretation of things in the world.
I was amazed by Gregerson’s breakdown of Donne’s "musicality" and "rhetoric" examples that were given. She broke them down and took them to a level that I was fully capable of understanding. Besides just her analytical breakdown of the examples, I really enjoyed her thoughts on Donne’s religious poems. “[T]he poems that hold me longest, compelling me to return to them again and again, are the religious poems.” She writes of Donne’s brilliance and ability to speak not only to the individual in his religious poem, but of his capability to express his originality and his radical preciseness to everyone no matter where they were in the world. Linda Gregerson tells of her love for Donne’s religious poetry by describing their personal and social meanings. She says that even though he wrote so long ago, his poetry, especially his religious works, will last through centuries of metaphysical and ethical speculation. Because of all the incredible thought provoking lines of poetry, Linda Gregerson says, “So, to answer my friend’s question: Donne, John Donne”.
DeleteJess,
DeleteI really enjoyed this blog - I could feel that you were invested in it which is why I loved your first paragraph. The way you included your love for Emily Dickenson and briefly compared it to Gregerson's love of Donne brought your blog to a more personal level. I enjoyed how you dissected your favorite lines from Gregerson's article and that you took the time to research a few words so as to possibly better understand or provide a better understanding of what Grergerson meant. Although this was not a persuasive essay I felt persuaded by your opinion because you presented it easily and with a simplistic fluidity. When I finished reading it the first time I felt as if it had just slipped into my mind like silk whether or not I actually had the same opinion. I although thought that you used some nice words in here such as "speculation" and "compelling" - you know I always enjoy a good word! You did a very nice job of expressing your opinion on this blog and I felt as if I was learning more about you in conjunction with learning about Gregerson. Good work and I hope you enjoy the dance tonight!
Jessica,
DeleteThis was a very interesting blog to read, and I really enjoyed your opinions on the prompts provided in the question. Your very short anecdote at the end of the first paragraph put your views into perspective for me because not everyone shows the same reaction to a blog such as this. Your description of what you believed of the "high wire act" was slightly different than mine, drawing deeper thoughts out for me. It is good that you chose to search misogyny because that word and the understanding of it was necessary for the understanding of the phrase, do good choice. Your last paragraph on her thoughts on his religious poems were interesting. Your use of quotations from the article was well thought out and precise. Overall, your blog on this article was well developed and expressed. Starting the blog with a quote really worked well to entice your reader. All in all, I found this to be a very insightful blog. Good work.
Jess,
DeleteThis was absolutely one of your best blogs yet! Just by your structure and word choice, the effort you put into it really stood out. I loved how you opened up with the quote, “Poems weren’t yet alive for me; I didn’t know what to do with them.”. That was personally one of my favorite lines throughout her whole article, as I feel it is relatable in a similar way. I took Creative Writing courses, both one and two, last year with Mrs. Messineo. Combined, I took the courses daily for a year. I remember in the beginning of the year, I was so afraid to write and share with the class. I was too focused on making them something that people wanted to hear, so when I read my writing it sounded as if i was throwing up sunshine. I didn’t know what to do, so I didn't do anything special, I just wrote. I began writing darker topics that dug deeper into my mind, and they were better. I actually wasn't embarrassed of them anymore! It was as if my writing became a piece of me, giving them life and making my poems come “alive”. I know Kaitlin can agree as we made the transition from sunshine to rain together, with Ann helping us along the way! Anyway, I just really liked that quote and was happy you put such an emphasis on it.
Overall, your blog was lovely and I enjoyed reading it. P.S., you looked beautiful last night! I hope you enjoyed senior snowball. :)
Linda Gregerson's article "On John Donne" was very interesting and relatable. Her use of extensive vocabulary and anecdotes allows the reader of her article to understand her opinions to their fullest extent. She has enjoyed the poems of John Donne for many years, and decided when asked by a friend that John Donne had been the first poet she had fallen in love with. Throughout her article, the reader senses a genuineness in her article as she tells how she first fell in love with his "love poems" such as "The Flea" and "The Canonization". She uses dynamic wording to express her point, giving the feeling that she was enthused when she was writing about his poetry. She quotes her favorite passages from some of the poems, telling how she feels about each of them. She claims that Donne took her on adventures and fell in love with his poetry because of his excellent wording and intense conceits.
ReplyDeleteWhen she describes his poem, it's almost as if she is describing it in the way he would do. She calls his poems "high wire acts" which reminded me of a young girl watching in awe and terror as a stunt fanatic attempted to complete such a dangerous action. You are intrigued with the strength and courage that it took this individual to do such a thing, and one finds themself unable to look away, completely entranced. I fell the same way she did. This is such a relatable statement. As we read "The Flea" I thought "Why are you doing this to yourself?" His conceit was odd and his poem was almost legal in its tone. But then I was enraptured by his ability to turn such a formal piece into something so romantic that it has stood the test of time. When she says "his metaphors were intricate and wild and stretched to outrageousness" I feel that she is a residual adrenaline junkie, someone who finds it enthralling to watch as others bring adventure and adrenaline to the board. But it's such a genuine statement, and the reader knows that these characteristics of Donne's poems really allowed her to become a great fan and advocate of John Donne.
When she broke down his "musicality" with the examples in her article, at first I was skeptical. However, after reading them twice I was astonished. These were such interesting examples to choose and analyze. His poems "move from ease...to a more elegant ease" as she displays with her quotes. This description of his "musicality" of his poems brought deeper understanding to me about her opinions and choice of words. At first "musicality" seemed redundant. Poetry is supposed to be musical. But then I understood how she was exploring the extent of the musical qualities of his poetry.
Linda Gregerson finds herself drawn most strongly to the religious poems that Donne writes. She claims she can "inventory the stanza's minutest meanings" for long periods of time and never grow bored or run out of material. These poems require her to dig deeper into herself so that she may constantly question the metaphysical inquiries that Donne is laying before her. His love poems hold equal depth, but they cannot bring the intensity that the religious can, because they do not hold such mysteries as can be found in the religious ones. I really enjoyed this article,and it gave me some excellent vocabulary words to add to my collection.
Hannah,
DeleteI always enjoy reading your blogs because of your brilliant insight, and tonight was no exception. I really liked in your second paragraph when you described Gregerson's descriptions of Donne's poems as what he would most likely use to depict his own work. I never looked at it that way. With the whole "high wire act", we had different views. I pictured it as being the person walking across the rope as it wobbles yet steadies as the person nears the end. But, I thought your perspective was also great. I can definitely see what you mean by the awe and terror, almost like what I saw. I laughed when I read that you called Gregerson a "residual adrenaline junkie." I found what you said about the musicality of Donne's poems from Gregerson's eyes very interesting. I really loved looking at the two examples she gave in the article and seeing what she meant by ease and more elegant ease. Overall, Hannah, this was a wonderful blog. Keep up the great work!
Hannah,
DeleteI noticed you brought up Linda Gregersons beautiful and extensive choices in words a few times. I know we are not supposed to judge on things such as synonyms, but it is hard not to when her word flow was just so overall perfect! Without a doubt, her style of writing effected what her writing actually said. With how beautifully she wrote, she could have said the most ignorant, unintelligent thing possible, and I most likely would have still respected her due to her writing style. It makes quite the impact on the reader!
Overall, your blog was excellent as always. I love how you brought up specific thoughts you had in regards to our homework reading, the Flea! My group is presenting on it tomorrow, I look forward to hearing your reaction to our insights! Once again, amazing blog!
P.S. this may be a bit irrelevent, but I just noticed your profile picture! You look lovely!
When I looked up “On John Donne”, what I found was not what I expected. The first question in our blog this weekend was, “Is she genuine in her love of Donne's poetry?”. Maybe it was just me, but when I first read this question, I was expecting to find an article composed of false flattery in which the author would sarcastically compliment Donne’s work. I have to admit, I myself do like his work (so far), so I was not looking forward to the reading. Although upon reading, I was sucking in by Linda Gregerson’s specific detail and personal opinions. Of course due to preconceived ideas, I was reading into this from the standpoint that she was not sincere and insulting, so something didn't seem right. It wasn't long before I had to stop reading and start over. I was wrong, she was truly genuine in her love of Donne’s poetry and I just had to re-read while in the right mindset.
ReplyDeleteI thought it was so smart how Linda Gregerson introduced the topic. While I now know that Linda Gregerson is a poet, I didn't know this until after I had read the article. She did an excellent job at introducing herself. I loved how she opened up admitting poetry meant very little to her. However, at the same time she defended herself by expressing how much she loved to read. Then she claimed that John Donne was the one who got her into poetry. This really influenced the effect that her opinion would have on me. After all, his works opened up an entire new world to her known as “poetry”, or as she described it as,”a delicious adventure.” Donne’s works “seized” her “by the shoulders”, and make her feel “included”. But then again, as Gregerson mentioned, What sixteen year old girl wouldn't want to feel included in love poems? These were the ones that first reeled her in as she recalled. I thought it was a such a sweet thing to notice when put together. She never came out and said, “I was a sixteen year old girl in love with poems about love,” but different pieces in her article can be put together to finish this typical puzzle. In the beginning she mentioned how she discovered him at a young age while towards the end she commented saying it was most likely his love poems that drew her in.
While Gregerson said that the love poems attracted her, what really consistently won her was the religious poems he had written. Gregerson had nothing but good things to say about them with one of her most powerful compliments stating that his works were “something much larger than individual consciousness”. John Donne wrote within such a way of creatively diving into ones subconscious, as if he had emerged from their dreams. It can easily be assumed that John Donne’s religious poems are where he truly shined through Christ. Anything based on the main theme of religion is risky as religion has been and always will be a controversial subject, and Gregerson admits this saying that they were a “dangerous challenge” with stakes that were “unfailingly high”. Despite this, John Donnes religious works remained to be extremely successful as he wrote in a way that successfully made “the universal becomes personal”.
Along with all of this, Gregerson also did an amazing job explaining the “musicality” and “rhetoric”. She went into extreme detail, even pulling up excerpts for examples along with the poem titles to be looked up later. Gregersons article, On John Donne, was so much better than I anticipated and I enjoyed every word of it.
Felicia, I enjoyed how you weren’t afraid to admit what your thoughts were before you read the article. Although I have to disagree with the preconceived ideas about Linda Gregerson’s article, I applaud you for realizing you were in the wrong mind set and then starting over with a better one. I also very much liked how she opened up her article. I don’t know if I would say “she defended herself” when she talked about her loving to read and her lack of interest in poetry, but I can see where you are coming from. I absolutely loved how you even asked the question, “what sixteen year old girl wouldn’t want to fee included in love poems?” I mean, it’s true. I personally can’t think of any. I think that the female gender typically is more drawn into love poems than the male population because as little girls, most think about princesses and the love stories in books. We later find out that these dreams of marrying a prince and being whisked off to a magical place are rather unrealistic. Gregerson’s line about Donne’s religious poetry being “something much larger than individual consciousness” is my favorite in the entire article and I’m so glad you mentioned it because I think it really sums up her love for his poetry as a whole. Like you, I like what we have read of John Donne and can’t wait to read more. I’m glad you liked Linda Gregerson’s article like I did!
DeleteFelicia,
DeleteIt was nice to see your first attitude towards the article. I'm glad you decided to go back and start fresh though! I, too, believe Gregerson is genuine in her article about her love for John Donne's poetry. Everything she said was so detail oriented with a plethora of vocabulary words that I never even considered it to be satire. I also really liked that you discussed her introduction to the topic. I thought it was a great start to what you wanted to say in the blog. By the wonderful remarks Gregerson made about Donne's religious poems, I would really like to read one to see for myself, as she put it, the works that are "much larger than individual consciousness." Religious works are definitely risky, but that is what makes them so much more incredible to me because they defy the presumed norm. Your blogs are always so well-thought out, and this was one of your best yet. Wonderful job!
The article "On John Donne" written by Linda Gregerson is more informative on the authors writing skills than on her "love" for John Donne. I agree with her that his poems are "delicious adventure[s," but I would not categorize them as "sexy." She did mention that Donne's poetry is great for beginners. I do not know where she got that idea. I would consider myself a beginner when it comes to poetry, and I struggle to understand some of Donne's poems. His work insists on having my full attention. Many beginner poetry readers, including myself, need to be eased into his poems. Personally, I am happy that I had a background check on Donne because it is easier to understand his poems knowing who he was. It made his work more realistic.
ReplyDeleteGregerson's "love" for Donne seems fake. I understand that she does like his work; he is an amazing poet. But the way she words her love is over ambitious. Almost like she is in competition with someone, and they are challenging each other's love for Donne. I found it annoying. The way she described his work — "electric,... intricate,... wild,... stretched to outrageousness,... misogyny,... and sexy" — left a bad taste in my mouth. I do agree that Donne's work is all of these things, except misogyny. Although it may seem that he hates women through reading his poems, I do not think he does. Sometimes partners get frustrated with each other. Maybe his poems were like therapy to him. They allowed him to relieve himself of anger. It is a very common thing to do. That is why I would not say his work is based on hatred for women. She also mentioned how she finds his "athleticism... sexy." His work is sexy, in the sense that some of his work is based in sex. Yet, I would not quite say they are the sexy to the point of a romance novel. It just all depends on how the poem is read.
I absolutely love that Gregerson said she felt "included." That is a very important quality to have while writing poetry. It makes the reader feel one with the poem; almost like they experienced the scene their self. This made me excited. I had finally agreed with Linda Gregerson on something. John Donne had this special way of being able to draw his readers in. His conceits especially make me love his poetry even more. There are weird and beautiful at the same time. It is amazing how Donne was able to think of such peculiar ways to transform his audience's thinking by making them think.
Later on in the article, Gregerson takes bits an pieces of Donne's poems. She uses them to accentuate her love of his poetry. This is when I realized that her love is not fake. Her earlier words came off as though she was cheating me out of her real feelings for Donne, but she knows his language and thrives in it. Like her, I love the love poems. Except, she loves the religious/spiritual ones, as well. I do not hate them, but I would not choose to read about those ones. I should read them more because of my want to shy away from them. They allow us to really understand Donne and his life. He loved God, and was not afraid for the world to know. I think that is something to proud of due to the era he lived in. They did not particularly like Catholics, like himself (at first — he converted to the Anglican Church because of the religious unrest). Like Gregorson says, John Donne was of a "very odd religion that formed the horizon of comprehensibility in [his] John Donne's world."
Although I did not care for the way Gregerson opened up her article, I did like the information and love of Donne she had. It allowed me to understand Donne in a different way. So far, I really like John Donne's work (especially "The Flea"). He was a mastermind when it comes to metaphysical poetry, or poetry in general. He knew how to force his readers to continue reading and analyzing until they understood his work.
Kaitlin,
DeleteI enjoyed reading your blog this week. I agree with you a hundred percent that Donne’s poetry is not for that of an amateur/beginner, it is more for someone who has past experience in analyzing poetry. I could not comment as to his works being sexy, it just felt wrong to me personally. Trying to wrap my mind around his concepts as being “sexy” just never connected in my brain. So when I read yours it actually clicked and made it a bit less awkward. I would not know anything of the “Romance Novel” concept, in all honesty. Then your point on how an author/poets needs to draw the attention of the audience is so true. If one cannot succeed in doing that there work goes off and becomes just another “die-off-fad”. Her words to me still felt as if she was just getting out of Donne’s work, and into another poets work. She did indeed seem to have a “fake” love/passion for his work. I find it astonishing of how much his religion influenced his writing, although he would’ve been persecuted at the time of his life. Your last point in your fourth paragraph, "very odd religion that formed the horizon of comprehensibility in [his] John Donne's world.” , made me think about what Donne would do today. Like just what he would right, or what he would do in today’s society. In the end good work, Kaitlin.
This article by Linda Gregerson was very intriguing, especially since I haven’t really been able to get into the mindset of Donne. I have to agree with many of the point she made in her second paragraph. His language used, in the pieces we have had read, was electric. Each piece is an adventure into his thought process, and trying to decipher his meaning/plot of his piece. Her choice of words though in her last point makes me question her credibility a bit, “preening and misogyny”. Misogyny, I can partially understand, however I don’t get the point on preening. Preening is defined as the process of working a metal's surface to improve its material properties. I don’t see how that applies to John Donne at all, unless there is something I’m missing. Another point I don’t get is that she says that she “loved getting lost in” the books/novels and plays she was reading at the time. However, she never really got into poetry that just doesn’t seem right to me. I have personally loved to read poetry, to further my own ability as a writer. Also I don’t know why but I don’t feel that she is true fan of Donne’s; I feel that she was for a time a fan-girl of his poetry. Like for a time she couldn’t get enough, then she slowly grew on another poet/author’s work.
ReplyDeleteI personally don’t see Donne’s pieces to be described with “musicality”, the quality of being melodious and tuneful. When I read that point in this blog I attempted this weekend to put some of Donne’s works to chords, mentally. It didn’t really work it makes the poem lose the meaning it was originally ascribed to have. Then the points she provided still did not help me any when attempting to put then to more chords. Then I was gracious for the point on his works being described as rhetoric, the art of effective or persuasive speaking or writing, especially the use of figures of speech and other compositional techniques. That is the one way I can describe his works and how all of his pieces appear to me. Each new piece I read of his is that of great complexity and detail. His pieces of poetry exemplified through his metaphysical style that posed questions of topic we wouldn’t ever consider.
I truly did enjoy reading her analysis towards the end of the article. Her point that stood out to me is that of “[She] can inventory and admire…minutest means [/details]”. Which I think can apply to our minor discussions of Donne’s poetry. We might think that we are hitting every point and deciphering them into plain explanations. When in all actuality we are only scratching a surface of the metaphysical layers that are Donne’s work.
Devyn,
DeleteI really enjoyed reading your blog this weekend. You always present such interesting opinions for consideration, and this week you do not disappoint. I agree that her opinion on his writings being "electric" was close to a perfect description of his work. However, when you said that her mention of "misogyny and preening" confused you, I was a bit perplexed. Then, I read the description that you had found of preening. Preening can sometimes also mean " to make oneself presentable" or having "pride in one's self". I think that these definitions might help you solve what Linda Gregerson meant when she said that. However, on this point, her vocabulary in this piece was very interesting and complex.
However, I must argue your point about how you cannot understand her inability to delve into the world of poetry. When I was younger, I found myself drawn to poetry, but never in the extent I was with books. I believe that for me, books were an opportunity from escape from the stressing events of life at that time. Poetry was only an escape for about four minutes depending on the length of the poem. A book was something I could get lost in for hours, days, or even months. To me, it makes sense that a younger girl would not really be able to understand the allure of poetry I the way that her older self can.
I like how you say that "rhetoric" is the way you see Donne's poetry, but you don't see it as musical. I find both of them in his poetry. You mentioned trying to set his poems to chords, but I don't believe that is what she really meant when she said "musicality". To me, the music found in poetry is more the flow of the lyrics. When we read "We Real Cool" there was a rhythm to it, making it almost a rap, but Donne's poetry is more like a love song, one of those odd slow ones you'd find from an alternative band. His words flow and ebb, creating a rise and fall just like themelody in a song. There is intensity and softness just as sheet music is marked with forte and pianissimo. This was really an intriguing approach to this blog and I enjoyed reading your input. Good work Devyn.
Devyn,
DeleteI thought your blog was well thought out this week. Except, you mentioned that you did not understand why Linda Gregerson used "preening" to describe Donne's work. Like many words, preening has more than one meaning. I actually did not find your definition, but I did find that it means "to take pride or satisfaction in (oneself); gloat" (thefreedictionary.com). This would make more sense for John Donne's work. Out of what our class has read so far the male in each poem — "The Apparition" and "The Flea" (not so much "A Valediction: Forbidding Mourning") — tries to take give a woman everything so he can gloat at all his doings, and then expect her to give into him.
I love how you ended your blog. You are absolutely correct. We do not hit all the aspects of John Donne's poetry. He is so complex it hurts. Each time I think about his poems I find a new detail I missed before. Also, you tried putting the poems to chords. That is very creative. I would have never thought of doing that. Great job this week, and I realized that Hannah and I both wrote about preening just as I was about to post this. But anyways, great job this week.
I can relate with your struggles of “getting into the mindset of Donne”. That was how I felt with “Crime and Punishment”; no matter what I did or how much we talked about it, I just couldn’t get into it. The definition I found of the word preening is something along the lines of devoting effort to making oneself look attractive and then admire one's appearance. So, I’m not quite sure how much you researched the word itself. I can understand where Gregerson was coming from when she said she couldn’t ‘get lost in’ poetry. It’s not for everyone by any means. Take the example of Dr. Pam’s book club. She enjoys reading thought provoking books like “Crime and Punishment” while some others in her book club would rather read something like “The Fault in Our Stars” or something to that sort. It’s all person preference. I’m not a huge fan of historical fiction books, but that doesn’t mean my opinion couldn’t change if I found someone like Gregerson found Donne. Although I don’t agree with you about her feelings for Donne’s poetry, I can see where you’re coming from and applaud you for going against the crowd and stating your opinion. Take it from someone who went against the class with my feelings for C and P; it’s not easy to do. When I think musicality, I think about the flowiness (I know it’s not a word but it describes my thoughts the best) of something. For example, in ballet class at dance, my instructor is always harping on us about our musicality. It’s more the ability to flow smoothly without interruption. So I don’t agree with you on that point either. I think Donne’s poetry is full of musicality. To me, musicality is more of a feeling for each individual person rather than something that can be uniform. Overall, even though I didn’t agree with a lot of your points, you did a nice job!
DeleteWhen I read Linda Gregerson's first paragraph in her article "On John Donne" I knew I would like her. I find it extremely interesting that she was not enthused by poetry when she was younger because now she is a renowned American poet. I think this reveals a lot about the time act Donne has on the people who read his poetry. Personally, I'm not a huge fan of poetry, but I actually enjoy reading John Donne's work because of the outrageous, intricate, and raw material and ideas he conveys.
ReplyDeleteI honestly believe that her love for John Donne's poetry is genuine. Reading into the second paragraph gave me a feel for why Gregerson loves Donne's poems so much. Gregerson called Donne's poetry a "delicious adventure," and I think this truly represents how she perceives his work. Think about it--when something is delicious you want to savor every last drop (or in this case, every word) and remember its enriching taste and the experience of the adventure. I was reminded of the aspect of metaphysical poetry of shocking the reader when she acknowledged his language as "electric." His syntax is so revealing and wild that the reader can't help but be surprised and intrigued. Referring to it as a "high wire act" brings attention to how unbalanced his verses may seem, but in all actuality each one connects the other, just like how the rope is attached from one end to another. Sometimes the rope is just a tad too loose and the person walking on it wobbles going across the middle until he almost reaches the end, bringing him back safe and sound. Gregerson also pointed out John Donne's use of metaphors and how he is capable of stretching them "to outrageousness." When I read that I could only think of the compass conceit he produced in "A Valediction: Forbidding Mourning." This metaphor is so unthinkable that it is completely brilliant, which is one of the reasons why I am enjoying his poetry.
Linda Gregerson also did a breakdown of the musicality and rhetoric found in John Donne's poetry. His poems can simply go from "ease to yet more elegant ease." I never really thought about there being different types of eases in poetry, but after reading the examples Gregerson provided in her article I can most certainly see what she means. The rhetorical means found in his poems, expostulation, petition, and casuistry, are written flawlessly. I especially liked the casuistry, which is the use of clever yet unsound reasoning, in "The Flea." When I read it a few days ago for class I absolutely fell in love with it.
Although Gregerson first fell in love with Donne via his love poems, she also made it clear that his religious poems had a major influence on her fondness for him. She pointed out that "the stakes are unfailingly high, at once intensely personal and intensely part of the social and historical sphere." In these poems, the crises unveiled are relatable to everyone in one way or another. For example, Gregerson pointed out the famous "tree" that everyone knows out of instinct. These poems have the ability to bring readers together due to this common knowledge. These simple elements and Donne's poetic intensity "can make us feel something of what it would be like to inhabit so paradoxical a faith." I think this is why Gregerson appointed Donne as the poet she first fell in love, and I totally agree.
Natalie,
DeleteI found your blog very interesting because it came from the opposite view point of mine. By that, I mean that you like Donne and I cannot imagine reading him for pleasure and that I have always loved poetry while you, like Gregerson, found a love for poetry within his work. At the same time, though, you and I agreed the Gregerson's love for Donne's works is genuine. Because we agree, I think that her article plainly reveals her emotions towards Donne unless we are all missing some intricate form of satire here. As you stated, Gregerson showed a affinity for Donne's religious poems because they were more risky. I wondered how you felt about his different types of poems as someone who appears to generally agree with Gregerson's opinion of Donne. It was nice that Gregerson went beyond expressing her opinion and actually analyzed some of Donne's methods and meanings through excerpts of his poetry. She did create a better understanding of the different flows and references that occur in his poetry, which was important because these factors contribute to the overall metaphysical style that is so characteristic of Donne. You did a lovely job expressing your opinion and commenting on Grergerson's article - nice work, and I hope you continue to find more poets that capture your attention as Donne has.
Natalie,
DeleteYour blog this week definitely gave me ideas/concepts to consider, as we finish our minor Donne unit. My favorite part however was your second paragraph, explaining the points that were in question this week. I had completely discarded the word “delicious when doing my blog not thinking anything of it. Now I see that I made a great error in my fault of discarding it. When something is truly delicious you do tend to savor it, so you have an implant of it in your memory. Then also that one unexpected ingredient that can make, or brake, a dish reminded me of your point on metaphysical poetry. Metaphysical poetry thrives on thinking on topics that not to many people think of, and the conceits of unexpected comparisons that bring it to life. His Outrageous conceits are what put him on the map in my mind. The ideas he can think of truly are awe-inspiring, and a true creative inspiration for my writing. I can see your point that his works, “ease to yet more elegant ease." , as we dive further into his work. Although I still don’t think her love is genuine, and more along the lines of a fad love. The simple elements of Donne’s poetry such as relatability, simplicity, and passion are what make his works so great. In the end Natalie, your blog gave me points to sleep on and I thank you.
Natalie,
DeleteI am not so fond of Gregerson like you are. After I read the whole article I saw that she does truly love John Donne's poetry, but I felt like she is fake at the beginning of her article. She over exaggerated her love for him to the point where I just did not want to read the rest of what she had to say. I loved Donne's work since the first poem we read. He is brilliant, and Gregerson sees and loves that about him, as well as I do. But I got the sense that Gregerson is the person to say hi with a fake, cheesy smile to make people think she is kinder than the normal person, when really she's just as judgmental as the rest of us.
I love that you brought up the "high wired act." This is one of my favorite things that Gregerson mentions. Donne seems to have his own world when it comes to poetry. He does not care if it has a specific rhyme or meter. But the ease in which his words flow is beautiful. I think his poetry makes much more sense than some work from more modern/contemporary writers. You also said you fell in love with "The Flea." I did too! I think we can all relate to it in some way. Isn't it crazy how poetry can bring us together? Great job this week, Natalie!
Upon reading Linda Gregerson's article I was struck by two things: first, how extensively she exercised her flattering vocabulary, and second, how passionately she views the works of John Donne. It is obvious that Gregerson is a fan of Donne's "intricate and wild" conceits and "intensely personal" religious poems. I have to confess, though, that it was hard for me to follow this article with a deep interest because it felt like a sugar-coated analysis dipped in chocolate and sprinkled with pure adoration. Although we have only read a couple of Donne's poems my opinion so far is that he is a master of metaphysical poetry but I am still partial to the works of Poe, Neruda, and Plath. So to read an article that so plainly praises every aspect of his work held no interest to me, although the article was well organized. It is because of this that I am going to focus more on the structure and purpose of Gregerson's article than the content.
ReplyDeleteFor me, one of the most enticing aspects of Gregerson's article was the fact that she provided excerpts from several of Donne's works and used them to illustrate what she found to be the best characteristics of his poetry. By doing this, Gregerson also offered her reader a better understanding of Donne by explaining his religious, rhetorical, and romantic poetry separately. Although her opinion created a one-sided view of Donne's work she was thorough and intelligent in her multiple miniature analyses. Her most prominent section was that which considered his religious poems. Gregerson referred to these poems as "intensely personal and intensely part of the social and historical sphere." By this, she mean that Donne infused many of his own beliefs and intimate feelings towards God into poems that influenced an entire following of those of the same faith. Donne's religious poems are of "unfailingly high" "stakes," but Gregerson also mentions other topics that Donne's poems address that are risky - mainly "preening and misogyny."
It is almost funny that I first though of "The Flea" when I began to read Gregerson's article. I felt as if Gregerson herself had fallen into the trap of Donne's tantalizing conceits that often attempt to lure women into doing his will. Gregerson spoke of how she felt "included" and "dazzle[d]" by Donne, and perhaps that is because, at least in the poems we have read, Donne is often addressing a woman. By addressing I mean he is often attempting to convince them of his thoughts or trick them into his actions. It is true, as Gregerson says, that Donne's words are "wonderfully far-fetched" and "flattering," but they are also where Donne's misogyny takes place. Donne is not a misogynist, meaning he does not hate women. On the contrary, he takes the time in several of his more romantic poems to "admire" and "flaunt" his women. I only consider this to be somewhat misogynistic because I do not and have never, in Donne's poem or elsewhere, appreciated women being falsely flattered and fluffed for the sake of an ulterior motive. Donne does have an ulterior motive, that cannot be denied. Sometimes the speaker just wants to win and argument or reassure someone and other times he is seeking, or even demanding, physical satisfaction. These instances are often metaphorical for some greater meaning, though, which is what proved Gregerson's opinion of John Donne as a master to be true.
The most important thing that I took from Gregerson's article was that the reader must always be prepared for the "honest work" presented by Donne's poetry otherwise they would miss the references to "cosmology, cartography, contemporary politics, law, logic, [and] physiology." Regardless of the fact that I found Gregerson's article to be flowery and over adoring, she was thorough in her presentation and analysis of several quotes from Donne's poetry. I believe that her love for Donne is not seen in the words she used but in the time she dedicated to highlighting some of Donne's best poetic attributes and quotes in her article.
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